Use of Firemans lift during evac

[WICN1981]

I absolutely agree, especially as we have several FFL in the building.

My building has 7 floors, we are on 4th and 2nd and 4 fire exit cores in the building with protected stairwell. Each core has a FFL but only one has a refuge, the one that everyone in the building gravitates to so causes huge delays!

Our staff have got better since we reminded them that there isn't just one fire exit on the floor(s). However, other occupants seem to leave their staff to go wherever.

The FFL in each point goes to the basement (-1) and to the top floor. It doesnt have any way to communicate out from it though so if trapped in the lift (and one or two have malfunctioned at various points in the last few years when acting as passenger lifts) you could be in there for a while!

[1804]

Similar issue when I worked at a v. large hospital just outside Cambridge. For context, 'A' block was the original section of the hospital which then grew outward in either direction so that is 1/2 mile long. 70s construction so no FFL installed at the time.
Outermost buildings at each end are newest and had FFLs installed when completed. Trouble is that wards etc change position within the overall structure as new sections are added. Everyone wants a new and shiny workplace. Suffice to say that the neuro is housed in the original block 'A'. Neuro and on the 5th floor, neuro theatres. Every single patient from 1st floor to 5th was in a bed and would have to be evacuated in that bed. Level of dependency rose with the floor level so theatres on level 5 had patients having brains operated on. The thought of trying to evacuate such patients mid op was a bit more than scary as we could think of no way to get them to first or ground floor - sideways travel available on those floors - without extreme issues resulting, as you can imagine.
We kept pushing for ffl to be installed but it was not feasible within the existing old building, we were told.
Along come Cambridge FRS one day to practice in a training room with our bariatric dummy - 28 stone - as they didn't have one. Had to go past 'A' block to get to the room and the shift manager said 'I didn't know you had theatres up there'.
Went from there. We had spent years telling the Board to install a fll and got nowhere and it took a month and a threat of closure of the whole block by CFRS for the money to be found. They had to build a new block onto the old one, providing two flls. Cost millions. They tried thinking of relocating the whole of Neuro to another block but couldn't.
They were able to save face in a way as operating theatres and operations are the biggest source of income per procedure in most Trusts so it would pay for itself in ten years.
Moral of the story - listen to the fire advisers you employ. And both lifts have always been used as standard lifts by staff and to move patients, since day 1 until they get switched to ffl mode. None if that 'can't use those lifts' attitude.
Moral of the story 2 - just think WWMD? (What would Messy do). That works every time for me.

[Messy]

Moral of the story 2 - just think WWMD? (What would Messy do). That works every time for me.

Its true, I never make errors and I am always right - my wife often tells me this , but oddly only during rows

My eureka moment was when I did an audit at a hospital in West London. It was straightforward- they weren't complying with the law, I would issue a notice and the NHS trust would do as they were told

Their fire officer was fantastic and became a personal friend later. He admitted the Trust was failing (in relation to replacing fire detection systems) but to do the work in the time scale I wanted, the trust would have to close a ward. It wasn't possible to find the thousands of pounds to do the work without doing so

I was shocked as the loss of this resource was not what I wanted. The fire officer and I worked on a 5 year plan to do the work we had wanted in 6 months! We set gateway targets throughout the period. If the Trust fail to meet targets, the original enforcement notice would be issued

It was a nightmare for me to get my bosses to agree to the phased approach, but I did manage to convince them that a mix of patience, bravery and pragmatism was the way to get the job done

From then, pragmatism became my guiding rule, rather than code hugging and it's seen me well.

I am 98% retired now, but look back at some of my professional achievements with warmth and pride

[1804]

Shame you weren't involved with another major London Trust who asked me to go and work for them. In one of their East London outposts- still a sizeable hospital - the underinvestment in the Fire detection system was so poor that in A&E it stopped working. Old panels with no replacement parts available when failure of the system occurred etc. Trust said that there was always so many people present that a fire would always be noticed quickly!
So the LFB gave them an ultimatum - fix it or close it.
Trust didn't believe they would do this. How wrong they were. Imagine the knock on effect on other emergency departments in nearby hospitals and the ambulance queues.
I found all of this out after I had arrived to decide if I was going to take the role. After hearing the negativity from everyone I spoke to I said thanks but no thanks.
I have to add that the Trust was given a lot of warnings before the prohibition order was issued. Still, only time that I have known an A&E to be closed.
Trust finance manager is still in post. So is Chief executive.
How?

[stephen1974]

LOL, to me a firemans lift is tossing someone over your shoulder and carrying them out. I genuinly had a 'wait, what?' moment when people tsrated talking about a lift lift.

[Alexis]

LOL, to me a firemans lift is tossing someone over your shoulder and carrying them out. I genuinly had a 'wait, what?' moment when people tsrated talking about a lift lift.

You weren't alone in that thought Stephen.

Same here, but as I read on, I discovered I didn't even know a mechanical Fire Persons lift even existed!

We learn something new every day.